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Re: Call of Cthulhu vs Dungeons and Dragons

Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 5:47 pm
by Howard
Scriven wrote:I cut my teeth on basic ("Blue Box") D&D back in, what, '79 I guess, but mostly played AD&D growing up in the '80s.
If your talking the Cook Expert Box set, then I'm right there with ya, same path.
Scriven wrote:Just out of curiosity, would anybody be interested in playing in a darker, grittier, BRP-based fantasy game set in or around Fritz Leiber's city of Lankhmar? I've been kicking that idea around quite a bit lately. I used to run a Lankhmar-based campaign using the old TSR supplement for AD&D back in the day, but it could be totally cool to reinvent it from the ground up for BRP. Could even include Mythos elements, considering the Lovecraft-Leiber connection. Just a thought for a future project...
We wore-out the AD&D(1st Ed)Lankhmar map&book we played it so often. I have a Lankhmar boardgame from the mid70s but only played it once a long time ago. I would be interested but the stars would have to align for me to be available these days. It's possible, keep me informed.

Re: Call of Cthulhu vs Dungeons and Dragons

Posted: Wed May 01, 2013 1:30 am
by Shannon Mac
I enjoyed 1st ed AD&D and basic before it and to some extent I enjoyed 2E.

But 3rd, 3.5 and 4th feel too much like video games and I'd rather play a good fantasy video game if I want to kill things and attain power. That platform arguably does a better presentation than most of the D&D tabletop games I played later. One exception was a dude who ran a setting based on fairy tales on Earth but he had advanced degrees and made his game 85% non-combat.

Whenever I attend cons I typically avoid D&D though I will sometimes play in one that looks really interesting. I find games with less crunch are more appealing though not to the point of the Indie games.

Re: Call of Cthulhu vs Dungeons and Dragons

Posted: Wed May 01, 2013 6:28 pm
by ToCKeeper
Before you read this remember that if you have a good group it doesn't matter what game or game system you play. The game will be fun.

If you aren't used to combat being the answer to all of a party's problems, get used to it. Encounter levels ensure the party is never in too much danger. Combat is also the primary way to gain experience, and since the only way to improve your character is through experience getting into combat early and often will mean you gain levels faster.

If you like to have a PC with unique skills and abilities don't play 1st ed, 2nd ed, or many of the OSR games. For the most part you are only able to select from a small number of classes. Every instance of a class gains the exact same abilities at the exact same time, regardless of how you use your character. For example, if you are playing a rogue but decide you don't want him to be a thief too bad. At level X you gain the lockpicking ability and even if you decide in your backstory that your rogue doesn't break into houses, you still gain the ability. It doesn't matter if you ever use the ability either. You are a rogue and according to the rules all rogues pick locks.

If you don't like spending hours pouring over splat books to ensure you are creating the best possible character possible, you probably should't play 3.0, 3.5 or Pathfinder. In these editions they expanded skills and feats so you can personalize a character. The problem is they pumped out so many splat books that it is possible to make extremely broken characters.

If you don't like World of Warcraft don't play 4th edition. 4th ed is basically a tabletop version of MMO combat. Complete with requiring parties have each of the main types of classes: tank, healer, controller and dps. They also threw out most of the non-combat related skills and abilities they added in 3rd edition.

At the end of the day, just remember that Gygax and Arneson were wargamers. They did not set out to create a narrative based game of shared-story telling. What they wanted to create was a wargame where the basic unit of the game was a single character instead of a squad. Every edition of D&D reflects this wargame background. Skills are based around combat, characters are based around combat, stories are based around combat, and feats are based around combat.

-Dan

Re: Call of Cthulhu vs Dungeons and Dragons

Posted: Wed May 01, 2013 9:30 pm
by Thomas R. Knutsson
ToCKeeper wrote:Before you read this remember that if you have a good group it doesn't matter what game or game system you play. The game will be fun.

If you aren't used to combat being the answer to all of a party's problems, get used to it. Encounter levels ensure the party is never in too much danger. Combat is also the primary way to gain experience, and since the only way to improve your character is through experience getting into combat early and often will mean you gain levels faster.

If you like to have a PC with unique skills and abilities don't play 1st ed, 2nd ed, or many of the OSR games. For the most part you are only able to select from a small number of classes. Every instance of a class gains the exact same abilities at the exact same time, regardless of how you use your character. For example, if you are playing a rogue but decide you don't want him to be a thief too bad. At level X you gain the lockpicking ability and even if you decide in your backstory that your rogue doesn't break into houses, you still gain the ability. It doesn't matter if you ever use the ability either. You are a rogue and according to the rules all rogues pick locks.

If you don't like spending hours pouring over splat books to ensure you are creating the best possible character possible, you probably should't play 3.0, 3.5 or Pathfinder. In these editions they expanded skills and feats so you can personalize a character. The problem is they pumped out so many splat books that it is possible to make extremely broken characters.

If you don't like World of Warcraft don't play 4th edition. 4th ed is basically a tabletop version of MMO combat. Complete with requiring parties have each of the main types of classes: tank, healer, controller and dps. They also threw out most of the non-combat related skills and abilities they added in 3rd edition.

At the end of the day, just remember that Gygax and Arneson were wargamers. They did not set out to create a narrative based game of shared-story telling. What they wanted to create was a wargame where the basic unit of the game was a single character instead of a squad. Every edition of D&D reflects this wargame background. Skills are based around combat, characters are based around combat, stories are based around combat, and feats are based around combat.

-Dan
This was one of the best descriptions of D&D I've read, IMHO. :bow:

Re: Call of Cthulhu vs Dungeons and Dragons

Posted: Wed May 01, 2013 9:36 pm
by Wordcraftian
ToCKeeper wrote:Before you read this remember that if you have a good group it doesn't matter what game or game system you play. The game will be fun.

If you aren't used to combat being the answer to all of a party's problems, get used to it. Encounter levels ensure the party is never in too much danger. Combat is also the primary way to gain experience, and since the only way to improve your character is through experience getting into combat early and often will mean you gain levels faster.

If you like to have a PC with unique skills and abilities don't play 1st ed, 2nd ed, or many of the OSR games. For the most part you are only able to select from a small number of classes. Every instance of a class gains the exact same abilities at the exact same time, regardless of how you use your character. For example, if you are playing a rogue but decide you don't want him to be a thief too bad. At level X you gain the lockpicking ability and even if you decide in your backstory that your rogue doesn't break into houses, you still gain the ability. It doesn't matter if you ever use the ability either. You are a rogue and according to the rules all rogues pick locks.

If you don't like spending hours pouring over splat books to ensure you are creating the best possible character possible, you probably should't play 3.0, 3.5 or Pathfinder. In these editions they expanded skills and feats so you can personalize a character. The problem is they pumped out so many splat books that it is possible to make extremely broken characters.

If you don't like World of Warcraft don't play 4th edition. 4th ed is basically a tabletop version of MMO combat. Complete with requiring parties have each of the main types of classes: tank, healer, controller and dps. They also threw out most of the non-combat related skills and abilities they added in 3rd edition.

At the end of the day, just remember that Gygax and Arneson were wargamers. They did not set out to create a narrative based game of shared-story telling. What they wanted to create was a wargame where the basic unit of the game was a single character instead of a squad. Every edition of D&D reflects this wargame background. Skills are based around combat, characters are based around combat, stories are based around combat, and feats are based around combat.

-Dan
Thank you so much everyone for taking the time to respond. This has been very helpful!

Re: Call of Cthulhu vs Dungeons and Dragons

Posted: Thu May 02, 2013 6:40 pm
by ToCKeeper
Wordcraftian wrote:
ToCKeeper wrote:Before you read this remember that if you have a good group it doesn't matter what game or game system you play. The game will be fun.

If you aren't used to combat being the answer to all of a party's problems, get used to it. Encounter levels ensure the party is never in too much danger. Combat is also the primary way to gain experience, and since the only way to improve your character is through experience getting into combat early and often will mean you gain levels faster.

If you like to have a PC with unique skills and abilities don't play 1st ed, 2nd ed, or many of the OSR games. For the most part you are only able to select from a small number of classes. Every instance of a class gains the exact same abilities at the exact same time, regardless of how you use your character. For example, if you are playing a rogue but decide you don't want him to be a thief too bad. At level X you gain the lockpicking ability and even if you decide in your backstory that your rogue doesn't break into houses, you still gain the ability. It doesn't matter if you ever use the ability either. You are a rogue and according to the rules all rogues pick locks.

If you don't like spending hours pouring over splat books to ensure you are creating the best possible character possible, you probably should't play 3.0, 3.5 or Pathfinder. In these editions they expanded skills and feats so you can personalize a character. The problem is they pumped out so many splat books that it is possible to make extremely broken characters.

If you don't like World of Warcraft don't play 4th edition. 4th ed is basically a tabletop version of MMO combat. Complete with requiring parties have each of the main types of classes: tank, healer, controller and dps. They also threw out most of the non-combat related skills and abilities they added in 3rd edition.

At the end of the day, just remember that Gygax and Arneson were wargamers. They did not set out to create a narrative based game of shared-story telling. What they wanted to create was a wargame where the basic unit of the game was a single character instead of a squad. Every edition of D&D reflects this wargame background. Skills are based around combat, characters are based around combat, stories are based around combat, and feats are based around combat.

-Dan
Thank you so much everyone for taking the time to respond. This has been very helpful!
I'm glad I could help and I hope I don't come off too negative. (I just reread that post, sorry for all the typos...)

-Dan

Re: Call of Cthulhu vs Dungeons and Dragons

Posted: Fri May 03, 2013 8:23 am
by TAK
ToCKeeper wrote:
I'm glad I could help and I hope I don't come off too negative. (I just reread that post, sorry for all the typos...)

-Dan

Trust me, I would've been much less kind toward the game, which is partly why I decided not to say much.

Re: Call of Cthulhu vs Dungeons and Dragons

Posted: Sat May 04, 2013 12:12 am
by Keeper Dan
Toni held back. I may have to add that to the next Crier! :D :prop:

Re: Call of Cthulhu vs Dungeons and Dragons

Posted: Sat May 04, 2013 5:48 pm
by TAK
Keeper Dan wrote:Toni held back. I may have to add that to the next Crier! :D :prop:
Whaaat?! I'm not outspoken I tells ya!

Re: Call of Cthulhu vs Dungeons and Dragons

Posted: Tue May 21, 2013 3:12 pm
by AshtonRCClarke
All fair points, but remember that a D&D (or any) game is only as good/lousy as the guy who runs it.

Sure, the system is geared toward a hack&slash style of play, but an intelligent player can achieve just as much through roleplaying and a well-thought-out selection of skills. Munchkinism and power-playing only become a problem if one lets one's players run with it.

Also the only D&D stories "based around combat" are the ones that you purchase, either stand-alone or as part of various campaign settings. They have to be - most players like generic hack&slash, this is what sells, and such scenarios are almost inevitably terrible. But any gamemaster deserving the title of gamemaster should be able to create original stories, NPCs, locations, etc., and as such is free to make his campaign take whatever course he (and the players) choose. This goes for D&D just like for any other system.