Blacjack - Sap - Kosh

Combat rules discussion. Beat them up, blow them up, burn them up, blow them away. If it ruins someone's day, this is probably the forum to talk about it.
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Whitechapel Jack
Joined:Sun Aug 04, 2013 10:30 pm
Blacjack - Sap - Kosh

Post by Whitechapel Jack » Sat May 11, 2019 7:38 pm

I have a question about what other keepers think about the Blackjack in 7e. As a weapon it does 1d8 + db thats like a spear, heavy club or longsword...... A sap is 6" long made of leather or canvas with some lead bird shot in the end to give it some weight.... In 6e the sap had a special rule that the damage you rolled was compared to your hp and rolled on the resistance table to see if you were knocked out and without the book in front of me I think the target only took 1 hp of real damage but in 7e a ko is a maneuver (if you succeed the target takes 1 hp and is out cold, pg 125 of keepers book)
Without the special rule I feel the damage is to high, the weapon just isn't big or heavy enough to justify it. I think it was basically copy and pasted without changes because really no other weapons were changed that I see and they just didn't think of this.
I have thought about it a good bit and rejected a few ideas as pointlessly complex and since the ko is a maneuver unnecessary. In the end I have thought the best solution was to just reduce the damage to 1d3+1 like brass knuckles or 1d4 like a small knife. Someone suggested a bonus die on the maneuver to ko someone because that's what its made to do, not sure about that.
Anyway I would love to receive some input

Thanks A Bunch
Keeper Drew

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Daemon Sultan
Daemon Sultan
Joined:Thu Jul 26, 2012 2:14 am
Re: Blacjack - Sap - Kosh

Post by KeeperMurph » Mon Aug 12, 2019 1:17 pm

I would definitely agree with you. The damage on a sap/cosh is way too high in 7e, and most likely for the reasons you gave. I have come to the same conclusion in my personal games when it has come up and reduced the damage as well to that of a brass knuckles. 1d3+1 seems more than adequate for a weapon designed to incapacitate a person.

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